Denied Traitor Healing?

[Opalium]

Hi, Crescent.

There's been a lot of questions so far about why there aren't any ways for a traitor to heal. This is a point that should be discussed further, so let's dive into this.

TTT is a game that revolves around stealth and trickery. One of the ways TTT is designed to achieved this is by making traitors outnumbered. They are compensated with an array of powerful T weapons and obviously the element of surprise, but they are always a minority and therefore have to be very careful when taking risks.
Healing, however, changes this equation completely. Providing a traitor with a reliable method of healing negates the 'weakness in numbers' concept completely; when a traitor can heal, their limited collective health pool is no longer a problem.

When designing Crescent, we intentionally chose not to provide traitors with such healing methods in order to keep this core design intact. However, as noted by some of you coming in from other communities, as well as some gameplay data shows, providing no healing methods is not as straightforward as it seemed at first.

It is therefore why I am making this thread. I would like to hear your ideas an opinions on how should we go about this. Should traitors be able to heal? If so, how, and how much? If not why? Let me know your thoughts in the comments below, and together we'll find a way to answer this question properly.

~Opalium

 

[Infinity]

with how things are working it its makes it very very very very unlikely you to win against 4 or more full hp innos when its a 1v4
healing just gives you a better chance to make that possible
i believe it should be implemented

 

[Agent A]

Duplicate - Healing for Traitors

This is open for ideas. My idea is a medkit that does the following: If you heal yourself, you only get 25 hp. If you heal others, they get 50 hp. One time use so it can't be abused and encourages teamwork/cooperation between traitors.

crescent.gg

I just posted it there, but this works as well.

I don't like dolph1n's idea with sandwich and I think it should be chucked out entirely.
I don't like sgm's idea of deathstation heal.

However, what I propose is this: A medkit

• If you heal yourself, you only get 25 hp.
• If you heal others, they get 50 hp.
• One time use so it can't be abused and encourages teamwork/cooperation between traitors.

This fits within crescent's philosophy by making sure it's not over the top with the healing while being fairly balanced.

 

[Zyp]

I agree healing would be nice but still not favorable. What about an item that is activated like a disguise or such, basically you use it you take damage until 1, then it stops, you continue firing until time runs out, you then die if they manage to do that damage to you, my idea is probably wayyy to overpowered in how I'm saying this.

 

[CyanideaINaFISH]

I agree healing would be nice but still not favorable. What about an item that is activated like a disguise or such, basically you use it you take damage until 1, then it stops, you continue firing until time runs out, you then die if they manage to do that damage to you, my idea is probably wayyy to overpowered in how I'm saying this.

Can you elaborate on this and give more examples? I would like to see what how this would be used. Happy Gaming!

 

[Zyp]

Can you elaborate on this and give more examples? I would like to see what how this would be used. Happy Gaming!

it could possible be better called something like adrenaline shot, basically you cant be killed immediately, youre able to take more damage than the health you have for like say 4 seconds, it then wears off and you die of the damage that you took. That and to balance you can say that it kills you even if oyu dont take the damage of the hp you had at start. its a bit hard for me to explain further

Think of it as if you are holding the damage for like 4 seconds before it hits you.

 

[MisterWhy]

I definitely think we need some sort of healing around. Its just not doable to kill 10 innos or so with 100 hp

 

[Bob]

I really don't think healing is needed since the servers are capped at a relatively small playercount + the amount of T's that are selected every round is enough(even feels higher compared to most other servers).

Every traitor can buy a tomahawk, knife which guarantee a kill if used carefully and the frag grenade + incendiary grenade are pretty destructive(as long as movement speed stays about the same) both of which are available on maps and help with taking care of groups.

As someone said above the game is about stealth and trickery use these 2 things instead of just playing the gamemode as a team deathmatch. Detectives have access to the health station and rejuvenator which both heal and as a traitor you could decieve the detective to buy one of these then kill him and take there source of healing or just use it before getting found out as a traitor.

 

[Pigeon]

I have three things to say on the matter:

1) The game is about stealth and trickery, traitors should be deceiving the detectives into healing them.

2) Traitor healing makes the game stale imo.

3) This point is in favor of adding traitor healing: Leeching exists, but not for everyone. In a way, traitor healing already exists, and adding it as a t item would even things out for people without leeching guns.

All in all, there are reasons to add it, but I don't think it should be. If it is added, I think it should be really limited.

 

[Siddo]

Here's a revolutionary idea that would make healing risky, but still rewarding for a traitor.
A damage-heal. More precisely, a single use melee weapon that deals, like, 40 damage and heals the same to the user. Call it lifesapper or some gay shit.

For my money, what's most important when implementing traitor healing is that it should be weak and non-replenishable or risky to use.
Traitors should rely on stealth and deceit first and foremost. As such, healing should not be a crutch that lets them circumvent normal gameflow and sit patiently in a traitor room while applying a medkit to themselves, let alone spamming a health station of their own making. It should be something they can only attain by being stealthy and or taking a risk in return for a reward.

 

[Opalium]

I added a poll as well, to see what the general public thinks.

 

[rog the dog]

I personally love playing TTT how I'm used to, being able to expose myself and try to outgun everyone. Death station like stuff helps me do that.

But that isn't what this server is geared towards so we really shouldn't have anything like that. I really like @Eden's idea of having a T item that can heal your teammates, and if you heal yourself it heals significantly less or has some sort of other penalty. It seems balanced.

 

[Pigeon]

I personally love playing TTT how I'm used to, being able to expose myself and try to outgun everyone. Death station like stuff helps me do that.

But that isn't what this server is geared towards so we really shouldn't have anything like that. I really like @Eden's idea of having a T item that can heal your teammates, and if you heal yourself it heals significantly less or has some sort of other penalty. It seems balanced.

once you get your hands on a leeching gun that's totally doable, just a bit more calculated.

 

[Zach]

d's get their drones t's should get healing items

 

[Silly]

add an orange 1 time use gives you 50 hp

 

[ekksdee]

Sorry for the bump/necro, but I don't think typing up a new thread regarding healing would be suitable since there is already this topic....

So after playing for a bit of time and taking in the style of gameplay that CTTT has to offer, I have some opinions and a suggestion regarding healing for traitor as well.

Overall, I do think that the current state of the server favors innocents slightly more than traitors. Ideally you'd want a split 50/50 winrate for both sides, but the reality of that never really happens, however I do feel that it is currently 60-40 in favor of innocents, so it could be improved. This is from what I have seen in the past few days/week of playing, some may experience Traitors winning a bit more while others may experience Innocents winning by a landslide. But the average, (again from what I have seen), feels 60-40.

The short answer as to why the server favors innocents more is that traitors lack healing. The long answer is that the equipment offered to Detectives are significantly better, far more versatile, and very rewarding to Detectives. The biggest offender here are the Amazon Drones, they offer too much of a buffer zone for Detectives to be safe considering that they already start out with Bodyarmor which considerably reduces damage inflicted. So as a traitor you are presented with two options here: Get rid of the drone first OR cheese the detective with a one shot weapon (Knife, Tomahawk, etc). The issue is that both feel like a lose-lose situation, shooting or getting rid of the drone first before trying to damage the detective gives the detective too much time to react and punish you for trying to kill him. The other option involving cheesing the detective just feels really shitty for both sides at times, contrary to popular belief, not every traitor wants to spend a credit on a knife, tomahawk, etc solely to take out a detective, some do, but not the majority, however it tends to become a necessity at times due to how it would be significantly harder to take down an equipped detective that has Bodyarmor and an Amazon Drone ready to absorb damage/give him enough time to react and kill the traitor attempting to kill him....and obviously it feels shitty for the Detective that has to be knifed because realistically most traitors don't want to lose too much health or even die for trying to take on the detective. This is all while that the traitor is given the ideal circumstances that a crowd of innocents aren't closely by the detective, which does not usually happen.

So I do believe that a form of traitor healing should be added, however one that comes with a limited use/reasonable restriction, but gets the job done. The deathstation that was on STTT was far too good for what it did once you had that specific perk unlocked and it made the way for people to just toss them in traitor rooms, kill an innocent or two, then scram back into the traitor room to get back to full health. This was extremely unhealthy gameplay and just made it extremely easy to stay alive as a traitor. MG had a sandwich, which had limited uses, but in my opinion healed you for far too much (it had 4 uses, each use would instantly grant you 25 HP without any sort of restriction to movement speed, jumping, etc). I believe a good approach to traitor healing would be something similar to MG's sandwich, however with better restrictions. You should not be able to freely move and jump around when you want to heal, so perhaps make healing like a bandage gauze you'd find in a survival game such as.....Fortnite....where you have to stand still for a certain amount of time in order to complete the use and get your health back. The amount you heal back should not also be a great amount either, 25 HP would still be a lot even if you had to stand still and hold down a button to heal, maybe have multiple uses that heal around 15 health for a solo use, but if a teammate were to heal you then it'd be 20-25. If this item were to be added then traitors would be in a better position to handle more innocents without falling so easily, even while "playing stealthy", since at the current moment there are far too many things that hurt traitors (detective equipments, bad hitreg, people jump crouching with skinny models, a lot of open maps being voted, etc).

Perhaps a lot to read, yes, however if you're adamantly on the side of "Not wanting any healing" then give this a read and perhaps maybe you can agree with some of the points here as to why a regulated healing item for traitors would be healthy for the game rather than an unhealthy mess that we've seen on other servers.

 

[Sorcs]

A reasonable way for traitors to heal should include high risk for high reward. Which can be accomplished in several ways.

1. Make it so that the action of healing will take a long period of time
2. The action of healing is obnoxiously loud
3. For the heal to be successful it requires a specific situation/action.

From my experience, I personally enjoyed servers having the "Cannibalism" traitor swep. This would require a player's corpse for consumption, takes 4 to 6 seconds to process, heals 25 health, and only has 4 charges. This would allow healing, yet make it risky, time consuming, and takes some effort and tactical thinking to collect corpses to heal in a discreet place.

As "ekksdee" elaborated, traitors definitely need a way to heal to balance the game out and make the experience more enjoyable for traitors.